New clutch = big time wheel hop. How to eliminate this?

[Drakken]

Now that I have the CM Stage 1 in my xA I have noticed more wheel hop. Before it would wheel hop if accelerating in 1st aggressively. Now it will wheel hop if I slam 2nd and even a bit in 3rd.

Will an engine damper eliminate this? Any other tricks other than going easier on the car? BTW, I don't drive that aggressively often but when I do the hop is really annoying.

[bfurches]

the problem is those heavy ass rs1 wheels. Ditched mine and eliminated the hop :)

[Drakken]

the problem is those heavy ass rs1 wheels. Ditched mine and eliminated the hop :)


How heavy are they? I really like the RS1 wheels and can't really afford new ones. I'm looking for a cheap solution.

[Zillon]

I think it has more to do with the size of the sidewall, which is very small with the RS1 wheels. It doesn't allow the tire to absorb the force, so it's transmitted straight through to the wheel instead, which magnifies the hop through centrifugal force. Merely a thought.

I've just noticed that I don't get wheelhop with my steelies and a beefy sidewall, but I did with my 17's and even my 16's at times.

Ways to eliminate this? Run a taller sidewall. I'd try an engine dampener, front chassis bracing, and perhaps better motor mounts.

[simmo]

All that said above is true. However, replacing wheels wont eliminate wheel hop completely. I got 15lb wheels and still hop like crazy due to increased whp. Zillon is correct on tire size too, thats why im going to a smaller wheel bigger tire now.. And of course the best, yet the hardest and most expensive solution is to replace motor mounts... good luck, my buddy that works in pro race shop has called every possible company and none have them for xA.. so im gonna order custom made ones.. lots of $$$. Engine dampers will help, just wait till Ingalls come out with theirs.. should be any time now. April i think is official release date. Once i get my setup done, i will be able to give you more info on improvements and cost $

[DriverXa]

I feel its a tire/wheel problem. I peeled out the other day on one of those painted crosswalks, burned rubber really nice but as soon as I hit pavement major wheelhop. Since I had the wheels spinnin really good it should have kept goin on pavement no problem:shrug:

[bfurches]

You cant go any larger of a sidewall on the rs1's.

On my 16's im running a 55 series (on 205's) and im rubbing on hard corners.

Im def. going to say more than less its the wheel/ tire combo. With my 16's i have had virtually no wheelhop issues and those weigh in at 15lbs.

Might also be a driver issue too.
What rpm are you launching at when you get excessive wheel hop?

I launch at right around 2800 with no problems.

[simmo]

im a little confused.. wouldnt going to a lighter wheel increase wheel hop? isnt it easier to "lift" a wheel when its lighter? please explain

[DriverXa]

I was thinking, I've laid down rubber on alot of cars with almost as skinny tire that are stock on our car and never had a wheel hop problem.Since all of those other cars were much bigger with more powerful engines is it possible that the car being so narrow have anything to do with it?

[simmo]

i dont know.. i've burned rubber in hyundai accent 3 door and thats a pretty small car. I just think its the engine mounts that are way too soft.. Cuz even TC has wheel hop. Fact: a guy i know got 250whp on his tc, could hardly take off, replaced his engine mounts, done deal. no wheel hop what so ever. same wheels, same everything .

[bfurches]

The engine mounts def. have something to do with it. Without a doubt.

[Zillon]

im a little confused.. wouldnt going to a lighter wheel increase wheel hop? isnt it easier to "lift" a wheel when its lighter? please explain

A lighter wheel has less mass to throw around when it hops.

Thus, when you encounter wheel hop with a heavy wheel, it's going to be much more intense.

[DriverXa]

i dont know.. i've burned rubber in hyundai accent 3 door and thats a pretty small car. I just think its the engine mounts that are way too soft.. Cuz even TC has wheel hop. Fact: a guy i know got 250whp on his tc, could hardly take off, replaced his engine mounts, done deal. no wheel hop what so ever. same wheels, same everything .
gotcha.
what are the mounts made of rubber, urethane? it might be the material they're made of then.

[simmo]

kinda make sence.. im not saying u wrong lol.. im just trying to unerstand hehe..

[DriverXa]

kinda make sence.. im not saying u wrong lol.. im just trying to unerstand hehe..

Rubber mounts usually have alot of flex, with a very stiff urethane mount the engine movement will be kept to a minimum. Thats y suspension companies give u urethane bushing instead of rubber, lasts longer and is alot stiffer. If the factory engine mounts are rubber than that might be the culprit of the excessive engine movement and wheel hop.

[Philthy]

It's way easy to spin my stock 15" wheels that I have on now with zero hop. They're very thin wheels, though. I'll be putting on the RS1 Enkeis this weekend hopefully, so I guess I'll see how these fare. I'll try and weigh both wheels as well (with tire on unfortunately.) since no one seems to have any real idea what the RS1s weigh stock. I'm guessing 20, but who really knows. If it's 24 I'm going to cry.

[simmo]

Rubber mounts usually have alot of flex, with a very stiff urethane mount the engine movement will be kept to a minimum. Thats y suspension companies give u urethane bushing instead of rubber, lasts longer and is alot stiffer. If the factory engine mounts are rubber than that might be the culprit of the excessive engine movement and wheel hop.

lol I was actually responding to Zillon's message about the wheel/tire, and while i was doing that u posted a message in between . I knew about the mounts :) but its great info for someone who didnt know.. :hs:

[DriverXa]

sorry simmo.

[bfurches]

i believe the rs1 rims are 21.5 if my memory serves me right...

[simmo]

i just hope engine mounts and dampers will fix my problem. I really dont wanna sacrifice having wide wheels with low pro tires..
IF and when i go with wide body, i will have to get crazy wide wheels and if my car hops even more then, ill just shoot someone..

[Drakken]

The wheel hop has nothing to do with launch style. Today it is sleeting/snowing and it wheel hops when ever the tires spin.

[TurboEgg]

Wheel hop can also be atrributed to having to hard or too soft of a suspension, too much air pressure in your tires, even the surface you are on.

[Drakken]

Wheel hop can also be atrributed to having to hard or too soft of a suspension, too much air pressure in your tires, even the surface you are on.


It has always had wheel hop since I got it but since the new clutch is has been noticeably worse.

[DriverXa]

I think I have to second the suspension idea. If you ever come across an old TV show called Car&Track I believe they have tests of old muscle cars which is pretty cool. Anyway when they launch and stop the car, one in particular I remember, you could see how severe the wheel hop was. One car they had a slow mo cam going and u could see one wheel goin staight up into the wheel well and then the other in an alternating side to side bouncing motion:eek: tire broken up tire patches were crazy. I know the older cars had some sh*tty suspension setups, but maybe ours just isn't setup right to our cars.

[mine]

that was a great show i used to watch it on speed vision it was either on a ford or a chevy...

mopars never had that problem due too cause they have there axles off set forward on the leaf springs with no axle wrap...

[milezauto]

The wheel hop on these cars and all cars is caused by deflection. The torque on a leaf-sprung suspension causes the axle to rotate util the spring overcomes it causing it to snap back and resulting in hop. The torque on front wheel drive causes the control arm to twist until it can't anymore resulting in the same effect. A lot of time more horsepower and tighter clutches multiply this effect.

The cure is stiffening the control arm or bracing it so it can't rotate. The same thing as putting ladder bars on a leaf-sprung suspension. The axle can move up and down with suspension travel but it can't rotate.

I've been thinking about this problem and I'm going to look at some traction device options.

[simmo]

Mitch,
let me know what you come up with. As we discussed before, I am also planning on gettin custom axles made for my egg. You also suggested getting transaxle replaced too - stepping away from the wheel hop problem, into more or so adding power to our eggs and how it affects our front end.
A few people here are going to be increasing their whp one way or another and I think on our cars it is very crucial to remember about the front end :suspension, axles, control arms, tie rods, etc.
I think a rule of thumb to remember, if your wheels are spinning, you are fine. If your wheels are hopping, you might damage your suspension, control arms, etc. There will be a point however when you increase whp so much that your wheels just wont move.. yep.. no hop, no burn, thats when you need to replace axles - well actually you need to do that before lol otherwise you have a great probability of snapping them. I know i kinda stepped away from topic but i think its all related to one another.
I think Mitch will be a great person to comment on these kind of questions since he's got a great experience.

[mine]

The wheel hop on these cars and all cars is caused by deflection. The torque on a leaf-sprung suspension causes the axle to rotate until the spring overcomes it causing it to snap back and resulting in hop.

thats axle wrap for ya

[DriverXa]

milezauto very good info there. Looks like were finally closing in on the problem.

[dexter_5000]

i'd say the most of the underframe braces available. would help in ruducing the wheelhop issue.

[xSTANDxSTRONGx]

^^there's a good enought reason to get underbraces.

[milezauto]

Another thing I though of that woill help is stiffer engine and trans mounts. These seem to pretty weak.

Like I said, I'm going to look into this and maybe build a traction device.

I'll keep you guys posted.

[simmo]

Do it Do it! :ra: